How to quit AFROTC

[NiceDaysAhead]

If a contracted/ scholarship receiving cadet (in good standing) decides AFTROC/ military life is not for them in junior year, how do they quit? What is the process for leaving?

 

[EEBTTF]

Assuming you are asking for yourself, all of this information is in the contract that you signed. Your case if specific to you and I would start with your contract and then a conversation with your cadre.

 

[Tex232]

Short answer - you can do this either by not enrolling in any future ROTC courses or by simply telling your cadre you intend to break your contract.

Some people on here might give you crap for backing out. However the government breaks contracts all the time, they’re usually only concerned with contracts when it benefits them. That said, if you back out you may be called up as an enlisted airman and/or forced to recoup funds, and no one on here knows what the chances are of that happening. I will say that the military is not exactly hurting for recruits right now, so you should talk to your cadre and see if you can get some perspective on what lies ahead if you decide to quit.

Good luck.

 

[NiceDaysAhead]

Short answer - you can do this either by not enrolling in any future ROTC courses or by simply telling your cadre you intend to break your contract.

Some people on here might give you crap for backing out. However the government breaks contracts all the time, they’re usually only concerned with contracts when it benefits them. That said, if you back out you may be called up as an enlisted airman and/or forced to recoup funds, and no one on here knows what the chances are of that happening. I will say that the military is not exactly hurting for recruits right now, so you should talk to your cadre and see if you can get some perspective on what lies ahead if you decide to quit.

Good luck.

Thank you for your reply. Certainly, this can't be the first time this situation has come up, but also I have no idea how the process works. Does the AF require a particular reason for a decision to separate? Is this something that requires retaining an attorney? Do they need "find" something negative to say about you in order to allow the disenrollment? Any advice is appreciated.

 

[EEBTTF]

Thank you for your reply. Certainly, this can't be the first time this situation has come up, but also I have no idea how the process works. Does the AF require a particular reason for a decision to separate? Is this something that requires retaining an attorney? Do they need "find" something negative to say about you in order to allow the disenrollment? Any advice is appreciated.

You can't just walk in and say " I don't want to do this anymore" and not have ramifications. Assuming there are no medical issues that would prevent you from commissioning - the AF is going to want to be reimbursed for the costs associated with your scholarship. They may allow you to enlist or write a check back. As far as getting an attorney, take a few minutes and use the search function. There are many similar threads that may give you some idea about the process.

I go back to my original post, I am sure your situation is personal and unique. We are all merely speculating and providing general guidance. Your contract is very clear on what you signed up for. Your Cadre can help you with what your options are. Good luck.

 

[Percy]

Understand that if they let you walk without consequence it sets a terrible precedent.

If there are significant and substantial life circumstances, you may be able to secure a recoupment waiver. Otherwise, you owe the government the value of what they spent on you. Be prepared to serve enlisted or, as noted and more likely, write a check.

I do not agree with approaching the cadre first because everything you say to them will likely be cited in their disenrollment record report. Find a reputable civilian attorney with disenrollment and recoupment waiver experience and then formulate your written request. A military attorney will not likely be available to help because this is not an adverse personnel action or ordinary legal assistance issue so much as your impending and preemptive defense against a claim from the government.

If you disenroll and are recouped, your debt will be sent to DFAS and, if you have no DFAS income, on to the IRS, quite possibly as a non-dischargeable government-subsidized education debt (meaning no bankruptcy forgiveness, as with federal student loans). You'll adjust your federal tax withholdings after they recoup your first refund check but, eventually, they'll place a lien against your real property or garnish your wages.

Know the rules and what you are facing before you open your mouth:

https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a1/form/af1056/af1056.pdf (probably your contract)

https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a1/publication/afman36-2012/afman36-2012.pdf (Manual)

https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/au/publication/aui36-2602/aui36-2602.pdf (Instruction)

https://www.dfas.mil/debtandclaims/militarydebts/educationdebt/ (DFAS statement)

https://boards.law.af.mil/ARMY/BCMR/CY2014/20140003275.txt (BCMR example and reasoning)

https://casetext.com/case/ayers-v-us-dept-of-def-2 (US Bankrruptcy Court example, on appeal, and reasoning)

Here's the bottom line: if you don't want to serve and lead, it's really not in the Air Force's best interests to force you to...and I don't want you in my Air Force. If it was my decision, I'd recoup rather than force-enlist you and certainly wouldn't forgive the debt because you changed your mind after taking taxpayer money. At the end of the day, a deal's a deal and, unless there is a really good reason not to, you should honor it.

You might consider taking your commission and applying for Palace Chase to early-out into the reserves and bide your time with a good attitude and joyful heart.

Department of the Air Force offers limited Active Duty Service Commitment waivers; expande

These programs provide provisions for both enlisted and officer members who meet specified criteria. The application window runs Jan. 20 – April 2 and the expanded PALACE CHASE program window will run

www.af.mil

 

[Tex232]

You can't just walk in and say " I don't want to do this anymore" and not have ramifications. Assuming there are no medical issues that would prevent you from commissioning - the AF is going to want to be reimbursed for the costs associated with your scholarship.

Understand that if they let you walk without consequence it sets a terrible precedent.

If there are significant and substantial life circumstances, you may be able to secure a recoupment waiver. Otherwise, you owe the government the value of what they spent on you. Be prepared to serve enlisted or, as noted and more likely, write a check.

I knew a guy in ROTC who was contracted and dropped out the spring of the year we were supposed to commission, so pretty late in the ball game. Dude didn’t have to enlist or pay a single penny back. Granted he wasn’t on scholarship but he had still gotten a decent amount of $$ from the monthly stipend. My commander told me he was “very surprised” at the AF’s decision, although I wasn’t. For the OP, this is just anecdotal don’t take any of this as legal advice as to what you should or should not do or what may happen.

I do not agree with approaching the cadre first because everything you say to them will likely be cited in their disenrollment record report.

This is quite possible. If he decides to approach them first, he might want to consider going one on one with the commander so there are no witnesses present.

Here's the bottom line: if you don't want to serve and lead, it's really not in the Air Force's best interests to force you to...and I don't want you in my Air Force.

C’mon man you don’t own the service lol. But in all seriousness, I’m sure there’s a few people out there that would want to spite this guy for changing his mind. I know people here tend to get spun up over these things, but everyone makes mistakes, in his case it might have been signing this contract. That said, if he ends up commissioning, he should do his best to uphold the oath that he swears to.

 

[Capt MJ]

If a contracted/ scholarship receiving cadet (in good standing) decides AFTROC/ military life is not for them in junior year, how do they quit? What is the process for leaving?

There is always a fat instruction covering all aspects of unit administration. I found AFROTC instruction 36-2011, Ch. 16. One of your first steps, in addition to reviewing your contract as mentioned above, is researching the primary source document for policy and procedure. Find the most current release of that instruction, with up-to-date changes, and pore through it.

The reason consulting with a ROTC disenrollment attorney is mentioned is because once this process starts, the wheels of government will start to grind and are very hard to stop or adjust. If the AF isn’t getting a commissioned officer for its investment of funds, and there is no involuntary separation issue involved such as medical DQ or humanitarian, it will want time or money in repayment.

There have been several threads here over the years from former cadets still struggling with a crushing weight of debt, years later, impacting their credit, ability to buy a home, save for retirement, finish their education, etc.

The disenrollment lawyers, typically former JAGs, know the process inside and out, know your rights, how to phrase letters and requests, what can be negotiated, such as amount and terms of repayment. That has to be done early in the process, before the aforesaid wheels start grinding at full speed. If you Google “ROTC and service academy disenrollmemt JAG lawyers,” that will produce some results. Most will do a free phone consult first. Do your own research first as I mentioned above. Do your due diligence on the lawyers, researching their Better Business Bureau record, etc., and consulting with adults in your life.

In the meantime, be the best cadet you can be. Think this through, develop a plan, recognize it will be messy for a while, and most of all, be professional and mature about it. A positive and adult attitude and demeanor will go a long way toward smoothing the painful parts.

This could be easy or it could be bumpy, depending on the all-important needs of the Air Force.

Let us know how it goes.

P.S. I just ran the Google search. The same law firms I have seen over many years still pop up. There is no shortage of cases relating to military discharges, disenrollment and punitive actions.

 

[Percy]

I knew a guy in ROTC who was contracted and dropped out the spring of the year we were supposed to commission, so pretty late in the ball game. Dude didn’t have to enlist or pay a single penny back. Granted he wasn’t on scholarship but he had still gotten a decent amount of $$ from the monthly stipend. My commander told me he was “very surprised” at the AF’s decision, although I wasn’t. For the OP, this is just anecdotal don’t take any of this as legal advice as to what you should or should not do or what may happen.

This is quite possible. If he decides to approach them first, he might want to consider going one on one with the commander so there are no witnesses present.

C’mon man you don’t own the service lol. But in all seriousness, I’m sure there’s a few people out there that would want to spite this guy for changing his mind. I know people here tend to get spun up over these things, but everyone makes mistakes, in his case it might have been signing this contract. That said, if he ends up commissioning, he should do his best to uphold the oath that he swears to.

Tex,

1. He's under scholarship, so "I know a guy" isn't relevant

2. Agree-know your audience. If you're unsure and want to discuss, yes go have a discussion. But if you want out and all you want is out but are prepared to serve if forced, talk to the attorney first. Telling his cadre he wants out and then continuing in the program will put him under the microscope. But getting additional info from the attorney on whether or not to ever disclose that in the first place is wise in the event he decides to stay.

3. Yes, it is my Air Force...and every other airman's. If we all treated it that way, our countrymen would be better served. Did you read what I wrote about service? Your critique implies you didn't digest it, as it is quite parallel to your own comments:

"if you don't want to serve and lead, it's really not in the Air Force's best interests to force you"

"If it was my decision, I'd recoup rather than force-enlist you"

"a deal's a deal [...] unless there is a really good reason"

"bide your time with a good attitude and joyful heart"

 

[Tex232]

He's under scholarship, so "I know a guy" isn't relevant

Hence why I put in that disclaimer. The situation I mentioned was similar - maybe not exactly the same - but still relevant.

Yes, it is my Air Force...and every other airman's. If we all treated it that way, our countrymen would be better served.

Believe me man, I’ve done my time, so I know a thing or two about service. But I also know full well that the AF will continue to function just fine without me when I leave.

 

[OldMaverick]

I agree with the prior advice to consult an attorney before talking to the cadre. If you don't, I see two possible scenarios:

Best possible case: You have a "good guy" as a detachment commander. He takes your side, and figures out how to get you out of your commitment without any payback.

Worst possible case: You have a toxic personality type as detachment commander. He takes it as a personal insult that you want to decline an opportunity to commission, and personally sees to it that you are forced to enlist, and will get the worst AFSC and assignment.

Unfortunately, I've known more "worst case" types than "best case" types.

My experience is over 30 years old. I commissioned in 1989. When I signed my POC contract, we were in a period where we were starting to draw down. My two year scholarship had been canceled by the Gramm-Rudman budget freeze, and for four of the next five years, any POC who wanted to walk was given the chance to walk their senior year, with scholarship payback. When I signed my contract, I figured, I'd get a chance to back out if I wanted to.

This was also the year we changed detachment commanders. When I signed that summer, we had a "good guy" det CC, and after I was on contract, he was replaced by a "toxic" det CC. And he also brought on a Commandant of Cadets who was also toxic. It didn't take me long to decide that I wanted to leave. I didn't feel guilty about wanting to leave because I was not on scholarship, and back then, the "stipend" didn't even pay for the college credits for AFROTC. So I was paying for the privilege of toxic abuse from my cadre, and interfering with my studies. But I knew the terms of the contract I signed, and I intended to honor it until I was offered an early out.

My senior year, I made the mistake of confiding to some classmates that when an early out was offered, I intended to take it. Word got back to my detachment cadre. They were in the mood of wanting to disenroll and force-enlist cadets. So they repeatedly tried to trip me up by asking if I wanted to leave AFROTC. I always used the same formulaic answer: "I intend to honor my contract. However, if the Air Force offers to release me from my contract, I intend to evaluate my options."

In the end, my year group was the only year group over a five year period not to be offered an early out. And despite a last minute effort by my commandant of cadets to try to disenroll and force enlist me over our personality conflict, I was commissioned. I went on active duty, and despite my expectations that I would leave at the first early out, I made a 20-year career out of it, retiring as a Lt Col before I even met my Colonel board. And I got my graduate education (STEM PhD) paid for in the process. It actually worked out for me.

Looking back, I would have skipped AFROTC, focused on school, and if I still wanted to serve, I would have gone to OTS. That's my recommendation to anyone who doesn't need an ROTC scholarship to go to college.

My advice is to read your contract, know your contract, and honor your contract. With the way the AF fluctuates its personnel requirements, you may get an opportunity to either leave on mutually agreeable terms, or take a Reserve or Guard assignment instead of active duty. This opportunity may occur while still in college, or while on active duty. Stay out of trouble, keep your resume fresh, your debt down, and your savings up so you can make the jump when you have a chance.

 

[glen]

Find a lawyer with relevant expertise and experience and talk to them first. Usually a first consult is free or a small cost. Always know what your options are before you open your mouth or enter a discussion with cadre. Actually, this year seems to be a year in which many many worthy AF scholarship cadets are being cut from the AFROTC Program due to officer retention. So based on your personal situation, you may have more options than May appear at first glance. Best of luck